Bad Religion True North
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Nitroadict
January 21st 2013



124 Comments

Album Rating: 5.0

I agreed w/ Strazz earlier, but his historical revisionism regarding the importance of Suffer here is beyond
embarrassing, even when Graffin himself (or anyone who was old enough to make music back in '87 & actively
remembers it now) would dispute such generalized arguments.


IMO, punk revival / mainstream is actually dying, contra the "dying punk of 1987", and/or committing genericide by
incorporating more eclectic sounds and/or purposely marketing themselves to more lucrative audiences & adjusting
their sound in the process.


Dimsum & deadguy are on the money here. Epitaph will never release something like Songs About Fucking unless it
was overdubbed w/ emo vocals.





DeadGuy
January 21st 2013



366 Comments

Album Rating: 2.5

"Genericide." I fucking love it.
The most notorious crime in existence

I never knew that was a real term haha

Digging: Autopsy - Tourniquets, Hacksaws And Graves

Nitroadict
January 21st 2013



124 Comments

Album Rating: 5.0

Indeed: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generic_trademark

Masochist
January 21st 2013



7901 Comments

Album Rating: 4.0

'Suffer' revived the SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA punk rock scene in 1988. An important milestone, to be sure (considering the So-Cal bands who would use it as a template for commercial success half a decade later), but not for the entire genre.

donaldo11
January 21st 2013



53 Comments

Album Rating: 4.0

Hmmmm....now the arguments are just going a bit off the rail on both ends. Suffer was clearly an important milestone for the entire genre. It wasn't like the album just took off in Southern California. That album won legions of new fans across the entire country.

Punk may not have been dead, but Suffer made it a hell of a lot bigger.



Nitroadict
January 21st 2013



124 Comments

Album Rating: 5.0

Im not saying it wasn't important, but its not the entirety of the genre, either, as masochist said above. It's not a coincidence that most of the mainstream would point to Suffer as a starting point, in their minds, for punk, I don't think.

DeadGuy
January 23rd 2013



366 Comments

Album Rating: 2.5

"Suffer" is the shit obviously
The crusty/grindy shit was way better then though I thought

DeadGuy
January 23rd 2013



366 Comments

Album Rating: 2.5

"I'm not scared of dying
and I don't really care
If it's peace you find in dying, well then let my time be near
If it's peace you find in dying
when dying time is here
bundle up my coffin, cause it's cold way down there

Nitroadict
January 23rd 2013



124 Comments

Album Rating: 5.0

After the 1st listen, I think this would've been a more effective album if they hadn't made so many albums since Process of Belief.

I'll need to a few more to make a judgement.

Parallels
January 23rd 2013



6640 Comments

Album Rating: 3.0

Yeah but Bad Religion hasn't been truly effective since Generator & Recipe for Hate... Although I do have soft spots for The Gray Race and New America

Nitroadict
January 23rd 2013



124 Comments

Album Rating: 5.0

I'd have to disagree slightly, but I see what you mean. Process was the closest they got to sounding like their old selfs while still showing us their newer sound. Empire & New Maps have a certain sound to them that's diminished compared to Process or even The Gray Race, yet still has good songs, they're just weaker wholes.

Dissent of Man was more purposely folk influenced & I feel like was a proper follow up to Process, whereas Empire was the closest they got to an anti-Bush album, & New Maps was them trying to push Empire into darker & slightly faster territory.

After one listen, I think this would've been much better if Empire and New maps didn't exist. It does the faster songs much better than New Maps, much tighter (some tracks are rightfully only a minute or two long vs. the arena aim of Empire's lengths), & has a tighter narrative in the songs than those two, & probably more so than Dissent of Man.

I'm hard to pressed to find a bad song at all, but the superior material is made too familiar by previous exploits.


Killerhit
January 23rd 2013



4557 Comments


what the fuck is this shit

Nitroadict
January 23rd 2013



124 Comments

Album Rating: 5.0

Nothing to Dismay is an new classic, regardless, though. You can really feel them reaching back for the 80's in their instruments for that one.

DeadGuy
January 23rd 2013



366 Comments

Album Rating: 2.5

Yea Nothing To Dismay is the shittt

Masochist
January 24th 2013



7901 Comments

Album Rating: 4.0

I have to disagree, Nitroadict. 'Empire' is one of my favorite albums by the band, one that sees them take the revival of the album before and stretch that sound into something new and fresh. It's the 'Generator' of the 2000's, in my eyes.

Though I have to agree with you on one thing--had 'True North' been released right after 'Empire' (instead of 'New Maps of Hell'), they would have surely had another 'holy trinity' of albums for the 2000's starting with 'Process'.

That being said, I really like 'The Dissent of Man', and I enjoy all the songs on it...but it might've been more effective if it were cut down by three or four (non-live) songs.

Nitroadict
January 24th 2013



124 Comments

Album Rating: 5.0

Oh no doubt, I'm not bashing Empire, it's a good album; it proved to be a grower after the initial disappointment that it
wasn't like Process (not beyond the first 3 tracks), & held it's own w/ it's different production approach & purposely
slower, more melodic tempos in the 2nd half.

However, the chorus to Boot Stomping is still an embarrassing cop-out, & the Quickening isn't really a necessary song
either & slows down the album flow too much; I'm glad they kept surface of me off the album as it didn't fit at all, and
while it seems like nitpicking, these things prevent it from being a completely good album (Process only had the
somewhat redundant The Lie).

As for generator comparisons, I disagree; TESF is a good album but not in the same league.

As for Dissent of Man, 4 tracks kind of ruin the album (but if ignored it's more or less the best folk followup to
Process): the harmless but not needed 2nd version of Won't Somebody, Devil in Stitches (way too long), Turn Your Back
on Me & Where The Fun Is (two of the worst tracks Brett will ever write; ironic considering Only Rain is probably one of
his best ever as well).

New Maps I'd have to revisit. I listened to the hell out of that & kind of got tired of it at some point but it has a lot of
excellent tracks (I seriously hate Prodigal Son, however. Just boring).



Masochist
January 25th 2013



7901 Comments

Album Rating: 4.0

We differ in opinions again! 'Boot Stamping's' chorus is such an emotional part of the album, IMO...well, actually the whole song plays out like the Defeatist's Anthem, but the chorus is just straight heart-wrenching. Maybe it's Greg holding that straining high note so damn long, I dunno. Then again, I also know that my opinions on that song in particular are very far from the usual (most people I've seen online who like the album hate that song; I love it).

The 'Generator' comparison comes from the fact that it takes time to slow down more than once, and experiment a bit more than once. And even the super fast songs have lyrics that aren't so straight-forward. Compare the songs "Generator" and "All There Is"...oooh, they both give me chills, not just for the melodies, but for their lyrics: "Like the blood on my door, wash me clean and I will run until I reach the shore" and, "Wretched Adams with hell to pay [are] content upon a rail of pain for just a pail of rain." (Though as good as "All There Is" is, "Generator" wins by a mile).

(If you're still reading, and frustrated about my constant defending of 'Empire'...just know that I'm a fanboy for that album. Look at my ratings--you'll notice I've rated each and every one of Bad Religion's LP's, but I've given only one of them a '5' ;-)...tell the truth, that'll probably change soon.)

Hahaha...I would choose two of those four songs that could be cut from 'The Dissent of Man', but instead of "Won't Somebody" and "The Devil In Stitches," it'd be "The Pride and the Pallor" and "I Won't Say Anything" for me. Not that the other two are my favorites or anything; I'm just used to them because they were among the first I ever heard off the album.

Everything you said about 'New Maps' applies to me. Exactly that.

donaldo11
January 25th 2013



53 Comments

Album Rating: 4.0

You would take off Pride and the Pallor? I think that's one of the best songs on the album. The backups are just unreal, so many oozin ahhs

What about Ad Hominem? That has got to be one of the worst BR songs in the past ten years, absurdly silly lyrics. I rate that one just above "My Computer".

Ad Hom gets a chop in a heartbeat, and where the fun is clearly should never have been put on any album.

Satellite
January 26th 2013



19929 Comments

Album Rating: 3.5

this is stellar holy fuck

Digging: The Menzingers - Rented World

DeadGuy
February 13th 2013



366 Comments

Album Rating: 2.5

get money, don't be no lame



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